Albin 27 Engine Repower &
Engine Room ReModel
This is my Albin 27 Engine Room Refit page, where I will chronicle pulling my Nissan Ld28 diesel, the rebuilt, and then the eventual engine room cleaning and refit. I've stripped pretty much everything else off the boat and the engine room remains. Once I have the engine out I can can strip out the remaining wiring and systems from the engine room. Some of the reasons I decided to do an engine room refit: broken water tank, wiring rats nest, and poor organization of systems. Since I already pulled out the broken fresh water tank and the too small waste tank, new plumbing will be a necessity. The rats nest of wires left behind has to go. Some wires are connected to nothing at all. Just zip tied in place. Some are in bad shape. Any painting inside the engine compartment needs to start with bare walls so this will eventually all be pulled out.
The Nissan Ld28 Diesel Marine Engine was a common power plant for Albin 27’s for production years 1985-1988. This engine is a Nissan Ld28 car engine, which was used in the Nissan Maxima car years 1982-1983. The core components of the engine are interchangeable with the automobile engine. Marine components, used to marinize the engine are unique and may not be readily available. Parts for this engine are not readily available. The Nissan Ld28 has a reputation as a strong and reliable engine giving several thousands of hours of continuous use. As a six cylinder diesel engine it not as noisy as other diesel engines used in the Albin 27. Owners report average speeds of 6.5-7 knots, with a fuel burn of approximately ¾-1 gallon of fuel per hours.
How to Remove the Engine
I removed the engine bay hatches. I got all the electrical and plumbing disconnected, labeling and taking pictures as I went along. Now I have to do the coupler. Also in looking at the engine mounts everything looks really good, but what do I unbolt? The single mount for the shock absorber or the actual engine bed mount ( 2 bolts per mount?). Turns out you unbolt everything and you need a very large wrench. Size of the wrench needed for removal of engine mount nut: 15/16"
Once I got the shaft off and everything disconnected, I decided to remove the heat exchanger so I'd have more room for pulling engine. Obviously it had been leaking. Then as I sat pondering my purpose in life I noticed the home made exhaust riser and I wondered why I could only see 3 stainless bolts holding it on. Poked around and decided let me pull this off and see what's going on here. The missing 4th bolt was sheered off on install I'm guessing. The manifold is looking rough. This does not bode well for the Nissan. I made some inquiries about rebuilding but this seems like a loosing battle. The engine is in rough shape. And then it turns out the wiring harness was damaged at engine. Once nuts were cut off the harness, opening the connector revealed corrosion and at least one connector pin pulled out. This is an item to check if you gave a Nissan Ld28 in your boat as the wiring harness sits almost right under the aft edge of the engine room hatches and any water can collect and run down on top of wiring.
I spent the winter waiting for this moment. If I can get the engine out of the engine room, I can strip the remaining plumbing and electrical, and begin power washing the hull and preping for interior repaint. My original plan was try and use a wrecker with a boom to pull the engine from the boat. I planned on them being able to reach the boat from thge side, approximately amidships. Otherwise I;d have to move the boat on the trailer, pulling it out far enough to get the wrecker vehicle behind it. This is how most people pull their engine on a A27, from the rear---but I didn't have that luxury in my current home made boatyard. I called a local yard and exchnaged photos with the owner. As I explained what I wanted him to do, it became apparent that a small wrecker wouldn't have a long enough boom, or the right angle to get up under the pilothouse and lift the engine.
At the same time, I got my hands on an engine hoist, so I will be able to move the pulled engine around the garage. When the wrecker service told me they couldn't get up under the pilothouse to pull the engine. I came up with the brilliant idea of trying to use the engine hoist to pull the engine and get it on deck. From deck level I could get it aft, where the boom could reach it and get it off the boat. The problem: the folding 2ton engine hoist weighs 145lbs and its 8 feet from the ground to the cockpit combing on the A27. How do you eat an elephant? one small piece at a time. So I disassembled the hoist into 3-4 pieces and then reassembled it inside the cockpit.
At this point I'm thinking I'm pretty cleaver. I took some measurements before I moved the hoist and confirmed it would fit in the cockpit, length and width wise. Further I determined that the hoist legs would actually be supported in the fwd engine hatch lip, spanning the open engine bay. This meant the engine hoist would in fact lift the Nissan out of the engine compartment. Once above deck, I could slide a engine compartment hatch door underneath and lower the engine to the deck, then slide it aft to where the wrecker boom might reach it.
But when I got ready to lift the engine out I utterly stymied. Turns out while the engine wouldn't fit between the hoist legs, due to the engine mount brackets, and the angle of the hoist leg supports. At this point I was beside myself. I just wanted the engine out, and I started looking at the pilothouse and how it was constructed and attached to the deck. Under the pilothouse trim it looked like less than a half dozen screws held it in place. It took ten minutes to unscrew everything and push the pilothouse forward. It weighed less than 100lbs. I decided when I re-installed it I would thru-bolt it to the deck solving another factory build issue.
At the same time, I got my hands on an engine hoist, so I will be able to move the pulled engine around the garage. When the wrecker service told me they couldn't get up under the pilothouse to pull the engine. I came up with the brilliant idea of trying to use the engine hoist to pull the engine and get it on deck. From deck level I could get it aft, where the boom could reach it and get it off the boat. The problem: the folding 2ton engine hoist weighs 145lbs and its 8 feet from the ground to the cockpit combing on the A27. How do you eat an elephant? one small piece at a time. So I disassembled the hoist into 3-4 pieces and then reassembled it inside the cockpit.
At this point I'm thinking I'm pretty cleaver. I took some measurements before I moved the hoist and confirmed it would fit in the cockpit, length and width wise. Further I determined that the hoist legs would actually be supported in the fwd engine hatch lip, spanning the open engine bay. This meant the engine hoist would in fact lift the Nissan out of the engine compartment. Once above deck, I could slide a engine compartment hatch door underneath and lower the engine to the deck, then slide it aft to where the wrecker boom might reach it.
But when I got ready to lift the engine out I utterly stymied. Turns out while the engine wouldn't fit between the hoist legs, due to the engine mount brackets, and the angle of the hoist leg supports. At this point I was beside myself. I just wanted the engine out, and I started looking at the pilothouse and how it was constructed and attached to the deck. Under the pilothouse trim it looked like less than a half dozen screws held it in place. It took ten minutes to unscrew everything and push the pilothouse forward. It weighed less than 100lbs. I decided when I re-installed it I would thru-bolt it to the deck solving another factory build issue.
Pilothouse out of the way, I call the wrecker. The thing about wreckers is they charge by the hour. A small one is $75, a bigger one $125. And they count the driving time to and from. And you have to make sure you have the right size, least the boom not reach far enough. I ended up sending several photos prior to the dispatch so the owner would be sure to send the right truck. From start to finish it took less than 20 minutes. The Nissan Ld28 came right out, minus the heat exchanger which was removed prior. If you find its a little tight, spin the engine diagonally and it will fit through the engine hatch opening no problem. My engine had two lifting points along the engine center line.
Fuel Tank Removal & Repair
While I never got an actual quote for a replacement fuel tank, I did make up a schematic drawing with the measurements and features a fabricator would need to know. Albin 27''s came with two fuel tank configurations from the factory: 1) a single 73 gallon tank under the cockpit in front of the aft cabin area; and 2) two 50 gallon fuel tanks in the aft cockpit/locker areas of the boat.
One of the reasons I never had a tank made is because I first decided to remove the tank to get measurements and clean/inspect it. My tank was approx. 73 gallons made by a company in FL which is no longer in business. Upon removing and inspecting the tank, I found that it was really well built, of heavier gauge aluminum (1/8" thick) with two baffels, etc. Based on my research to replace the tank it would cost at least $1,000 in order to duplicate all the quality and features. Plus there would be shipping, which was several hundred dollars in its own right, due to the size of the 73gallon tank.
I opted to repair the fuel tank myself, which is a good DIY project. Its not that involved, and can be done with normal tools. You can install inspection ports for future cleaning, update the fuel sending gauge, and improve the tank mounting. You can pay a fuel tank repair shop wherever you are to weld on replacement or patch aluminum to repair any pitting, holes or leaks. You don't need a marine welding repair shop, look for a shop that repairs semi truck fuel tanks. Have them repair/pressure test your tank AFTER you clean and install inspection ports, etc. You can put in 2-3 access/inspection ports yourself for less than $100, see my website. If you can remove your own tank, this is what I would do. Repair it yourself, and have the confidence to know you did it right. Below is a drawing based off my original tank, but I take no responsibility for accuracy of my notes, so check everything yourself before you use it. A drawing based off the 73 gallon fuel tank is posted below. I made the drawing based off my original tank, but I take no responsibility for accuracy of my notes, so check everything yourself before you use it.
One of the reasons I never had a tank made is because I first decided to remove the tank to get measurements and clean/inspect it. My tank was approx. 73 gallons made by a company in FL which is no longer in business. Upon removing and inspecting the tank, I found that it was really well built, of heavier gauge aluminum (1/8" thick) with two baffels, etc. Based on my research to replace the tank it would cost at least $1,000 in order to duplicate all the quality and features. Plus there would be shipping, which was several hundred dollars in its own right, due to the size of the 73gallon tank.
I opted to repair the fuel tank myself, which is a good DIY project. Its not that involved, and can be done with normal tools. You can install inspection ports for future cleaning, update the fuel sending gauge, and improve the tank mounting. You can pay a fuel tank repair shop wherever you are to weld on replacement or patch aluminum to repair any pitting, holes or leaks. You don't need a marine welding repair shop, look for a shop that repairs semi truck fuel tanks. Have them repair/pressure test your tank AFTER you clean and install inspection ports, etc. You can put in 2-3 access/inspection ports yourself for less than $100, see my website. If you can remove your own tank, this is what I would do. Repair it yourself, and have the confidence to know you did it right. Below is a drawing based off my original tank, but I take no responsibility for accuracy of my notes, so check everything yourself before you use it. A drawing based off the 73 gallon fuel tank is posted below. I made the drawing based off my original tank, but I take no responsibility for accuracy of my notes, so check everything yourself before you use it.
Here's how you remove the original Albin 27 Family Cruiser fuel tank:
1) Strip the entire aft cabin of headliner,trim, and wall panels. Remove the step and the boards that separate steps from tank area.
2) unscrew the tank from the mounting blocks which keep it off the floor.
3) Disconnect all your fill/fuel lines and vent hoses.
4) If your lucky and the tank has been removed before there may be notches cut out of the aft cockpit deck stringers so the tank with fittings can slide out. If not you may need to grind away some fiberglass so the tank has clearance to come out with the fittings. Some fittings are removable but the larger fill and venting are not.
Note: My tank has a builder plate from AFP tanks. Listed at 73 gallons. On the bottom of the tank I found red marker handwriting which reads "Albin Maine" and "73a" and also "1 of 7"
1) Strip the entire aft cabin of headliner,trim, and wall panels. Remove the step and the boards that separate steps from tank area.
2) unscrew the tank from the mounting blocks which keep it off the floor.
3) Disconnect all your fill/fuel lines and vent hoses.
4) If your lucky and the tank has been removed before there may be notches cut out of the aft cockpit deck stringers so the tank with fittings can slide out. If not you may need to grind away some fiberglass so the tank has clearance to come out with the fittings. Some fittings are removable but the larger fill and venting are not.
Note: My tank has a builder plate from AFP tanks. Listed at 73 gallons. On the bottom of the tank I found red marker handwriting which reads "Albin Maine" and "73a" and also "1 of 7"
This is the fuel tank space under the cockpit deck. Note the cutouts on the deck stringers to accommodate the tank fittings. Looking port. The black hose is the exhaust.The cockpit floor stringer is cardboard D channel glassed in three stringers. Make sure it's sealed in fiberglass if it's been cut away and not left exposed (like mine is). The hole in the deck is an inspection port for fuel gauge reading. There's a hole cut in the liner to give access to the bilge and the support bulkhead for the shaft. Actually keeping with the boat theme--several holes. "Why have one when three odd shaped holes will do?" Seriously?
Upon further inspection I've discovered that there are indeed two baffles creating three chambers inside the tank. The fuel gauge hole is just 2" on mine and I dropped a light inside to discover the tank is filthy with algae and it will be a serious cleaning job. Sorry no picture as the hole is too small. I'm considering cutting three access ports to be able to clean each chamber and scrub it clean. The only commercial access port I could find is Sea Built and they run $150-170 for a single 6" round port. To me it's cost prohibitive. I'm planning to cut my own ports approximately 5-8" rectangle with rounded corners. I would make my own alum covers out of 1/8" plate. I would tap and seal the covers just like the fuel gauge with a gasket or sealant. The tank is 1/8" thick and the fuel gauge is mounted this way. So I don't see why I can't do this DIY.
Waiting on a weather window to begin interior painting, I started on cleaning my fuel tank for the A27. I plan to install three home made inspection ports in the top of the tank. Because there are two baffles separating the tank I chose three compartments. I used a jig saw with metal cutting blade to cut the ports. The tank is robust and there was virtually no flexing.
The interior of the tank ended up being in reasonable shape. The brown and black gunk in the bottom of the tank was easily scraped out using an old epoxy fairing spatula. It appeared to be about the consistency of crumbled asphalt and coffee grounds. On the walls of the tank it was basically a thin film of oil/grease muck. No sign of organic life. At this point the tank was looking pretty good.
Experimented with cleaning using a steam cleaner, then Simple Green, then acetone. Hot water and simple green seems to work well although steam gets the corners. It will take a little work but the tank will clean up nicely.
The interior of the tank ended up being in reasonable shape. The brown and black gunk in the bottom of the tank was easily scraped out using an old epoxy fairing spatula. It appeared to be about the consistency of crumbled asphalt and coffee grounds. On the walls of the tank it was basically a thin film of oil/grease muck. No sign of organic life. At this point the tank was looking pretty good.
Experimented with cleaning using a steam cleaner, then Simple Green, then acetone. Hot water and simple green seems to work well although steam gets the corners. It will take a little work but the tank will clean up nicely.
I know there's been lots of debate about Loch Ness, Crop Circles, and the Diesel Bug. I prefer science as a candle in the dark, so while I mucked about with the tank I told my apprentice to fetch her Junior Science Lab Microscope and her goggles and get ready for the First ever Albin 27 Science Fair Experiment.
Topic: what is the muck in the bottom of the tank and are there any "bugs" there or amorphous fungi organisms noshing on my diesel sludge?
Well, let me say, first it looks, feels, smells, and tastes like dirt. Or broken asphalt. Or diesel coffee grounds with no coffee. I told my apprentice to load a slide and examine the substance under the microscope. "What are we looking for?"
My apprentice looked at me like I was stupid, as I tried to explain the various arguments in favor of paranormal diesel fungus. I recounted tales of mysterious substances "growing" in diesel drained into coke bottles in sunlight. Apprentice was not impressed and quoted Penn & Teller. "BS- be skeptical!"
I had the shop apprentice check the microscope twice. Myth Busted. The muck is petroleum by product and not organic. Science tells us less than 1%mass is organic. There you go.
Topic: what is the muck in the bottom of the tank and are there any "bugs" there or amorphous fungi organisms noshing on my diesel sludge?
Well, let me say, first it looks, feels, smells, and tastes like dirt. Or broken asphalt. Or diesel coffee grounds with no coffee. I told my apprentice to load a slide and examine the substance under the microscope. "What are we looking for?"
My apprentice looked at me like I was stupid, as I tried to explain the various arguments in favor of paranormal diesel fungus. I recounted tales of mysterious substances "growing" in diesel drained into coke bottles in sunlight. Apprentice was not impressed and quoted Penn & Teller. "BS- be skeptical!"
I had the shop apprentice check the microscope twice. Myth Busted. The muck is petroleum by product and not organic. Science tells us less than 1%mass is organic. There you go.
Bolting into top of tank worked excellent for the inspection ports and new fuel sending unit. I heartily recommend this DIY project. It's not necessary to purchase those Seabuilt inspection hatches ( which run $197 for one hatch). I put in all the hatches & sending unit, and got the tank welded for the cost of what would have been one hatch.Tank repaired by welder and pressure tested no leaks.
Engine Room Soundproofing
Onto engine room sound proofing. My original A27 had Soundown acoustic sound deadening barrier material on the underside of the engine room hatches. There was also some foam attached to the underside of the deck in the engine room haphazardly. The original hatch material was water logged and deteriorating. Not to mention the fasteners rusted in places, presumably from the hatch hinges where the bedding failed. When it rained, water permeated the foam and it held moisture over time. My plan is to use new Soundown material on the underside of the engine room hatches and deck. My engine room walls will be covered with systems so there's not much room for sound deadening material there. I will worry about that later.
Soundown is expensive. But good stuff. I described to them what I previously had and was pleased with, so they recommended the 2" 2lb material with the lead barrier. I ordered 4x6' which is enough for both hatches plus parts of the underside of the deck. It takes 8 pins per hatch for attachment. And you need the Mylar seam sealing tape & adhesive. I tossed the old material when I redid the hatches for paint, so I started with new patterns and cut the barrier to size.
With my original engine, there was nothing on the bulkheads, chock full of holes, systems and wiring. I found the noise not too bad. So I'm least concerned about that. And will add after the fact to open areas maybe. Probably 1" Soundown. If I do any bulkheads it will probably be aft most. I'm considering 1/4" hdpe sheets I have for bulkheads as a clean surface that I can pre-layout my systems for organization. It won't do much for sound but it can be cleaned super easy. Maybe a layer under that? But I think it would defeat the purpose. I'm primarily concerned with overhead and the large open areas there.
Soundown is expensive. But good stuff. I described to them what I previously had and was pleased with, so they recommended the 2" 2lb material with the lead barrier. I ordered 4x6' which is enough for both hatches plus parts of the underside of the deck. It takes 8 pins per hatch for attachment. And you need the Mylar seam sealing tape & adhesive. I tossed the old material when I redid the hatches for paint, so I started with new patterns and cut the barrier to size.
With my original engine, there was nothing on the bulkheads, chock full of holes, systems and wiring. I found the noise not too bad. So I'm least concerned about that. And will add after the fact to open areas maybe. Probably 1" Soundown. If I do any bulkheads it will probably be aft most. I'm considering 1/4" hdpe sheets I have for bulkheads as a clean surface that I can pre-layout my systems for organization. It won't do much for sound but it can be cleaned super easy. Maybe a layer under that? But I think it would defeat the purpose. I'm primarily concerned with overhead and the large open areas there.
Ughhh. Aftermounting the barrier materials with Soundown fastners, I have to say I'm very disappointed. The sound barrier material is great, the mounting system is another story. After getting everything mounted I realized the Soundown fasters are not made of non-ferrous material. The only thing that's non-ferrous is the dome caps, which appear to be aluminum, but the actual inside of the cap is made of the same material as the speed washers. The pin mount, pin mount base, and all wasters used to affix to the pins are ferrous. This seems like a total unacceptable mounting system for a marine environment. One of the reason I'm having to replace my Soundown in my engine compartment is due to the pins and caps rusting over time.
Why isn't everything made of a non rusting material? They're not even galvanized. These pins could have been made from plastic or something, or aluminum or stainless or something else. In addition 10 of the 12 dome caps you sent me were to big to even keep on the pins. I messed with the insides trying to close the pin hole, but they are worthless. The diameter of the pins is less than the diamter of the pinhole on the domecaps. Only two of the 12 caps actually stayed on the pins, once trimed to any degree. The rest all pushed right through the dome cap. Even the caps that fit properly are suspect.. The speed washers and insides of the dome caps will eventually rust in a marine environment, not to mention the pins, and then where will I be? (SEE UPDATE BELOW)
Why isn't everything made of a non rusting material? They're not even galvanized. These pins could have been made from plastic or something, or aluminum or stainless or something else. In addition 10 of the 12 dome caps you sent me were to big to even keep on the pins. I messed with the insides trying to close the pin hole, but they are worthless. The diameter of the pins is less than the diamter of the pinhole on the domecaps. Only two of the 12 caps actually stayed on the pins, once trimed to any degree. The rest all pushed right through the dome cap. Even the caps that fit properly are suspect.. The speed washers and insides of the dome caps will eventually rust in a marine environment, not to mention the pins, and then where will I be? (SEE UPDATE BELOW)
First let me say I contacted Soundown and they assured me the fittings are stainless. The stainless is magnetic which would indicated its 403 or some such grade. I even put the fittings in water for a while and no rust so that's good to go. Next, turns out the button caps come in 2 sizes, 10g and 12g, and sometimes they get mixed up. Soundown apologized and sent me the correct ones and extra hardware (because I ran out) all free of charge. Great service!
Regarding the hatches fitting. I haven't put them in completed form on the boat yet. But I was worried about the same thing, wondering if the barrier material would get squashed, or not fit, or tear from the way the hatches closed. So I dry fitted everything beforehand and took pictures. The way the hatches fit on the deck I see no problem running the the barrier material to the inside of the hatch lip. It's the hatch lip that sits on the deck and there's plenty of room for barrier material. Just to be sure I double taped my edges for antichaffe. I even marked with a black pen how far inwards you'd have to go to even avoid the deck. It's not feasible in my opinion. So I ran the material right to the edges. You will want that to plug the gap and keep the sound in. The material compresses quite a bit so there will be plenty of room. See the photos below.
Regarding the hatches fitting. I haven't put them in completed form on the boat yet. But I was worried about the same thing, wondering if the barrier material would get squashed, or not fit, or tear from the way the hatches closed. So I dry fitted everything beforehand and took pictures. The way the hatches fit on the deck I see no problem running the the barrier material to the inside of the hatch lip. It's the hatch lip that sits on the deck and there's plenty of room for barrier material. Just to be sure I double taped my edges for antichaffe. I even marked with a black pen how far inwards you'd have to go to even avoid the deck. It's not feasible in my opinion. So I ran the material right to the edges. You will want that to plug the gap and keep the sound in. The material compresses quite a bit so there will be plenty of room. See the photos below.
Clean Up Old Engine Bits
Working through the engine parts bin, I came across the raw water strainer. After disassembly, I realized the gaskets were shot and it was filled with 20yeads of crud. From measurements and the perko website I determined it's the #493-500 series 7 with the 1 1/4" outlets. That yielded the correct gasket kit and once the parts came, unit rebuilt.
Choosing an Engine for Re-power
So I signed up for BoatDiesel.com, paid the fee and was utterly disappointed. I signed up hoping to find a valuable source of info on rebuilding the Nissan Ld28. And there was purported to be a detailed Albin 27 repowering article that I thought would be worth the sign up fee.Boy was I wrong. There was virtually no info on the Nissan Ld28. The repowering article was terrible. It was little more than "I needed a re-powering and paid someone 15k+ to drop in a Yanmar for me." Bah! I asked for my money back.
Meanwhile, I'm holding in place and continuing to research the engine issues. I'm about 95% the Nissan will not be going back in so I have it listed it for sale. If I had the time and tools I'd probably attempot a rebuild, but I have too much going on with the boat refitt to learn a new skill set. I haven't given up on the outboard idea. But the outboard idea creates issues for battery charging, transom reinforcement, swim platform adjustment, controls, repair to the old prop space etc. As a backup kicker the Yamaha 9.9 with elephant ears is the way to go. But an actual power unit would need to be 50hp I think. I think a package would run $8k. For many reason I think diesel is probably where I'm going, and I like the Beta 38 right now for particular needs.
Update Fall 2016: My research on the Nissan Ld28 caused me to give up on rebuilding it. Another A27 owner suffered the same fate and chose the Cummings. I'm waffling between the Cummings 4b3.3m and Beta 38. Although I initially figured the Cummings 4b3.3m was the logical choice, the more I think about it and my refit, the more I wonder about the Beta 38. My research on the A27 and the HP needed to get the boat to perform various ways is at odds with the general opinions of most Albin 27 owners. Every time I bring up the diesel re-power question, apples get mixed with oranges. People try to argue resale value, designers intent, imaginary usage data, outrunning thunderstorms, just to justify large heavy engines in a boat designed to go hull speed efficiently. I think these arguments are vox populi. Albin 27 owners are a peculiar bunch, often embracing herd mentality, and the lesser informed among them.
I know I have read in several places that Albin advertised 10+ knots, but I know of very few people (actually I personally don't know of anyone) who actually cruised at that or more, for any length of time, no matter what their engine in an A27. Who has actually put in hours running at 10+ knots in an Albin 27 FC?? And how many times and in what conditions did they do it? What was the engine, and what did it cost in fuel?
I'm not saying you cant go 10+. I just saying I wouldn't think you get on an A27 and cruise 8 hours in 2-3 foot chop at 10+ knots. Seems to me the hull is not designed for that. Also seems to me that Albin 27 boats have very large engines for the hull shape, size and displacement. It might be that a 75hp diesel engine from 1984 is not the same or as necessary as a 75hp diesel engine from 2014.
Remember this is essentially a displacement hull with a very flat aft section. It only does what it does. Why did they put such a huge engine in this boat? Idk. Why do they make 1500cc motorcycles when a 650cc will do?Who knows? Maybe Albin was trying to be all things to everyone. They certainly did that in the head and the forward cabin. Maybe they realized that if you put 75-100hp in the boat you could get it up on plane on a lake or flat river and get 10+ knots (not that anyone would reasonably want to do this or could afford to do this for an extended period of time, or day after day). Sounds like a way to up-sell.
I'm not saying you cant go 10+. I just saying I wouldn't think you get on an A27 and cruise 8 hours in 2-3 foot chop at 10+ knots. Seems to me the hull is not designed for that. Also seems to me that Albin 27 boats have very large engines for the hull shape, size and displacement. It might be that a 75hp diesel engine from 1984 is not the same or as necessary as a 75hp diesel engine from 2014.
Remember this is essentially a displacement hull with a very flat aft section. It only does what it does. Why did they put such a huge engine in this boat? Idk. Why do they make 1500cc motorcycles when a 650cc will do?Who knows? Maybe Albin was trying to be all things to everyone. They certainly did that in the head and the forward cabin. Maybe they realized that if you put 75-100hp in the boat you could get it up on plane on a lake or flat river and get 10+ knots (not that anyone would reasonably want to do this or could afford to do this for an extended period of time, or day after day). Sounds like a way to up-sell.
4 Myths About an Albin 27 Re-power
Myth 1: the Albin 27 needs a large engine or it will be under powered.
I say not so. In reality the hull shape of the Albin 27 indicates that the most efficient maximum hull speed is about 6.5-7 knots. The Albin 27 was originally powered with the 60hp Ford Lehman diesel, later changed to the 79hp Nissan Diesel, and even later changed to the 157hp Isuzu diesel. What we have here is a case of the boat builder increasing the engine size as a marketing tactic to sell boats to a broader audience. To be sure the Albin 27 can go faster than 6.5 knots, due to the relative flat spots in the form of the hull aft. But this only means that if you put enough horsepower behind a displacement type hull, you can get any boat to exceed its hull speed. FYI: the Albin 27 needs only 18hp to max hull speed.
Myth 2: Albin 27's routinely cruise at 10 knots.
This was a key marketing point in the original and all subsequent documentation for the boat from the manufacturer. I think it was creative. People love to claim that the Albin 27 is "supposed" to be able to cruise at 10 knots. They will claim the Albin 27, by virtue of its magical "semi-displacement hull", will reach planing speeds around 10 knots plus. (We can debate whether its a semi-displacement or displacement hull, but I've always taken it as a displacement hull.) The reality is, very few A27 owners, in factory boats, ever reach 10 knots on a regular, sustained basis. The only exception are the later A27 boats that were configured as A27 Sport/FC models equipped with the 157hp Isuzu diesel engine. These boats can go faster than 10 knots. Most of the rest won't.
What allows for any chance of exceeding hull speed are the large flat expanses of the hull on the aft section of the boat as the keel turns upward. If you really research these owner accounts of 10+ knot speeds, its unlikely, even at 10 knots, they aren't actually planing unless they have a very light boat. For an Albin 27 to plane (or go 10+ knots) it's got to be practically empty. If you're packed for cruising, you're not routinely running 10 knots in an Albin 27. You will be lucky to even get up on plane. The fact is most factory equipped Albin 27's routinely cruise at 6.5 knots with WOT being somewhere around 8-9 knots, bow high depending on the weight. Those who have reached 10 knots report unstable handling until the boat even gets to 11 knots or beyond. These owners also report the engines are taxed to the max, the boat is pounded depending on the sea state.
When people say the Albin 27 is "supposed to cruise at 10-14 knots", ask them to show you a photo, a you tube video, anything that shows an Albin 27 Family cruiser with a factory equipped engine routinely doing 10+ knots. If someone does miraculously provide a such proof, then ask them what their fuel burn rate is at 10+ knots. It won't be 1 gallon per hour. Which is why no one routinely cruises at 10+ knots in an Albin 27 Family Cruiser.
From crawling around inside my bare interior, I can report the hull has no longitudinal stiffeners, there is no ribbing below decks. The hull of an Albin 27 is essentially a open fiberglass form, approximately 3/8" thick with a pan-liner inserted and attached for rigidity. So my opinion: while and A27 can go 10+ knots with a gigantic engine, the Albin 27 is not built or designed to that speed for a sustained period of time.
Myth 3: A big engine means I can escape a storm. Yes, and if you had a bigger boat, you could probably weather a storm. Whats your point? A big engine just means your engine is bigger, it weighs more, and it uses more fuel when you try to go fast. And no re-powering discussion should omit the topic of fuel consumption. You can either go fast, or go hull speed. Regardless of which engine your Albin 27 has, the most fuel efficient speed is hull speed around 6.5 knots. Owners report burning approximately 3/4 gallon of fuel per hour at hull speed, approaching 1 gallon per hour for 7-8 knots. Beyond that, fuel consumption increases dramatically based on your engine size.
I especially like telling the tale of the Albin 27 owner who re-powered with a Yanmar 100hp engine. Bob got a heck of a deal from his local Yanmar dealer on a refurbished engine. It had a turbo and everything To this day Bob recounts fond memories of the the theoretical ability of this engine to propel his boat at this and that speed under a variety of conditions. Of course there's no photos of the boat on plane, you'll have to take his word on it. But rest assured there are photos of the boat holed on a jetty when he ran outside the channel on the ICW. The boat sold at a loss, but to his credit Bob still pretends he owns the boat and proffers advice on why a big engine is better. You be the judge.
Myth 4: A smaller engine will reduce the re-sale value of the boat. Hmmm, let me think about this. On the one hand a prospective boat buyer could choose an Albin 27 with a heavy, high horsepower, thirty-five year old diesel engine that is no longer made, and spare parts are scarce. Or they can chose an Albin 27 with a smaller new engine that is more efficient, quieter, lighter, and utilizes new technology with a robust service and parts network. Since virtually every Albin 27 on the market has the original engine right now, I feel confident a prospective buyer will have many "original" boats to choose from. From a sales point of view, it makes sense to offer something other than whats already available. If you want an "original" boat, there's lots to choose from. If you want a refitted, modern boat, well then you can choose my boat.
I say not so. In reality the hull shape of the Albin 27 indicates that the most efficient maximum hull speed is about 6.5-7 knots. The Albin 27 was originally powered with the 60hp Ford Lehman diesel, later changed to the 79hp Nissan Diesel, and even later changed to the 157hp Isuzu diesel. What we have here is a case of the boat builder increasing the engine size as a marketing tactic to sell boats to a broader audience. To be sure the Albin 27 can go faster than 6.5 knots, due to the relative flat spots in the form of the hull aft. But this only means that if you put enough horsepower behind a displacement type hull, you can get any boat to exceed its hull speed. FYI: the Albin 27 needs only 18hp to max hull speed.
Myth 2: Albin 27's routinely cruise at 10 knots.
This was a key marketing point in the original and all subsequent documentation for the boat from the manufacturer. I think it was creative. People love to claim that the Albin 27 is "supposed" to be able to cruise at 10 knots. They will claim the Albin 27, by virtue of its magical "semi-displacement hull", will reach planing speeds around 10 knots plus. (We can debate whether its a semi-displacement or displacement hull, but I've always taken it as a displacement hull.) The reality is, very few A27 owners, in factory boats, ever reach 10 knots on a regular, sustained basis. The only exception are the later A27 boats that were configured as A27 Sport/FC models equipped with the 157hp Isuzu diesel engine. These boats can go faster than 10 knots. Most of the rest won't.
What allows for any chance of exceeding hull speed are the large flat expanses of the hull on the aft section of the boat as the keel turns upward. If you really research these owner accounts of 10+ knot speeds, its unlikely, even at 10 knots, they aren't actually planing unless they have a very light boat. For an Albin 27 to plane (or go 10+ knots) it's got to be practically empty. If you're packed for cruising, you're not routinely running 10 knots in an Albin 27. You will be lucky to even get up on plane. The fact is most factory equipped Albin 27's routinely cruise at 6.5 knots with WOT being somewhere around 8-9 knots, bow high depending on the weight. Those who have reached 10 knots report unstable handling until the boat even gets to 11 knots or beyond. These owners also report the engines are taxed to the max, the boat is pounded depending on the sea state.
When people say the Albin 27 is "supposed to cruise at 10-14 knots", ask them to show you a photo, a you tube video, anything that shows an Albin 27 Family cruiser with a factory equipped engine routinely doing 10+ knots. If someone does miraculously provide a such proof, then ask them what their fuel burn rate is at 10+ knots. It won't be 1 gallon per hour. Which is why no one routinely cruises at 10+ knots in an Albin 27 Family Cruiser.
From crawling around inside my bare interior, I can report the hull has no longitudinal stiffeners, there is no ribbing below decks. The hull of an Albin 27 is essentially a open fiberglass form, approximately 3/8" thick with a pan-liner inserted and attached for rigidity. So my opinion: while and A27 can go 10+ knots with a gigantic engine, the Albin 27 is not built or designed to that speed for a sustained period of time.
Myth 3: A big engine means I can escape a storm. Yes, and if you had a bigger boat, you could probably weather a storm. Whats your point? A big engine just means your engine is bigger, it weighs more, and it uses more fuel when you try to go fast. And no re-powering discussion should omit the topic of fuel consumption. You can either go fast, or go hull speed. Regardless of which engine your Albin 27 has, the most fuel efficient speed is hull speed around 6.5 knots. Owners report burning approximately 3/4 gallon of fuel per hour at hull speed, approaching 1 gallon per hour for 7-8 knots. Beyond that, fuel consumption increases dramatically based on your engine size.
I especially like telling the tale of the Albin 27 owner who re-powered with a Yanmar 100hp engine. Bob got a heck of a deal from his local Yanmar dealer on a refurbished engine. It had a turbo and everything To this day Bob recounts fond memories of the the theoretical ability of this engine to propel his boat at this and that speed under a variety of conditions. Of course there's no photos of the boat on plane, you'll have to take his word on it. But rest assured there are photos of the boat holed on a jetty when he ran outside the channel on the ICW. The boat sold at a loss, but to his credit Bob still pretends he owns the boat and proffers advice on why a big engine is better. You be the judge.
Myth 4: A smaller engine will reduce the re-sale value of the boat. Hmmm, let me think about this. On the one hand a prospective boat buyer could choose an Albin 27 with a heavy, high horsepower, thirty-five year old diesel engine that is no longer made, and spare parts are scarce. Or they can chose an Albin 27 with a smaller new engine that is more efficient, quieter, lighter, and utilizes new technology with a robust service and parts network. Since virtually every Albin 27 on the market has the original engine right now, I feel confident a prospective buyer will have many "original" boats to choose from. From a sales point of view, it makes sense to offer something other than whats already available. If you want an "original" boat, there's lots to choose from. If you want a refitted, modern boat, well then you can choose my boat.
What About an Outboard to re-power an Albin 27?
I have thought about a single Honda 4 stroke 30-50hp mounted on the transom. The modern four stroke engines are very fuel efficient and reliable. Since the hull speed is only 6 knots, could it be a simple solution? Being mounted on the stern, the engine could be raised out of the water when not in use. It could be fixed mounted, better yet, with steerage. This seems like a $6-8k repower option, but is it really? Removing engine creates space for tankage, and plenty of storage. Outboards are used on the Nimble boats. And in the British Hardy 25 motorsailers. And someone used a Honda for a Hankinsons True Grit.
Their reported fuel rate is not too bad. I already carry gas for my inflatable outboard, and probably for a Honda generator, so a gas engine would be a logical extension, no? The generator could be fueled by the same tank. The engine can be raised out of the water. The prop is not an issue as per the info below.
Their reported fuel rate is not too bad. I already carry gas for my inflatable outboard, and probably for a Honda generator, so a gas engine would be a logical extension, no? The generator could be fueled by the same tank. The engine can be raised out of the water. The prop is not an issue as per the info below.
If you read what other people are reporting about modern 4strokes properly pitched an outboard could work on an Albin 27. We are talking about hull speed on a displacement hull of 6knots. Sure gas won't be as efficient as diesel, of course. But if you look at the numbers it's not bad. Might it work in this application?
Check out the burn info from this website about a Hankinson True Grit. A new gas outboard repower could be 1/3-1/2 the cost of a modern inboard diesel. Thats a big deal. Combined with the advantages of being able to raise the motor out of the water, ease of maintenance repair, increased tankage and storage, etc.
Check out the burn info from this website about a Hankinson True Grit. A new gas outboard repower could be 1/3-1/2 the cost of a modern inboard diesel. Thats a big deal. Combined with the advantages of being able to raise the motor out of the water, ease of maintenance repair, increased tankage and storage, etc.
Re-power Options by Engine Make
Cummings diesel package from Trans-Atlantic Diesel. 4B 3.3 65hp @ 2800rpm The whole package is about $13,500 with panel mounts; basically $10,300 + a transmission. http://www.tadiesels.com/cu-B3.3M.html.
Beta Marine 38. The estimate I received put it about $11,500. That's for twin disc transmission, panel, mounts, etc. Betta Marine 43. Same set up, about $13,000; Beta Marine 60. Same set up, about $15,500 Sound Marine seems to be the Beta guy to go to. They have re-powered A25s, and at least one A27, but that might have been done in NC or FL. The tech help seems appealing. These prices may vary on the time of year and accessories included. These prices may be slightly old. This assumes I will use my 120 Balmar alternator. http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/
Used rebuilt or re-manufactured diesel like a Yanmar or something from a online diesel engine marketplace. But this really off the grid and DIY and you'll have to hunt for a good kit. http://www.dieselenginetrader.com/
Beta Marine 38. The estimate I received put it about $11,500. That's for twin disc transmission, panel, mounts, etc. Betta Marine 43. Same set up, about $13,000; Beta Marine 60. Same set up, about $15,500 Sound Marine seems to be the Beta guy to go to. They have re-powered A25s, and at least one A27, but that might have been done in NC or FL. The tech help seems appealing. These prices may vary on the time of year and accessories included. These prices may be slightly old. This assumes I will use my 120 Balmar alternator. http://www.soundmarinediesel.com/
Used rebuilt or re-manufactured diesel like a Yanmar or something from a online diesel engine marketplace. But this really off the grid and DIY and you'll have to hunt for a good kit. http://www.dieselenginetrader.com/
Update Spring 2017: Recently I started to question the benefit of the Cummings. Does the extra horse power do any good? One owner reports his boat rides bow high at WOT and he gets 9 knot max. I can supposedly get 8knts with the Beta in same situation. And if I can't, so what. I can't get 10 knots, very few people ever get 10+knots. Let's be honest. You don't burn less than 1 gallon of fuel like that. This boat is not built to run 10-14knots regularly. I've actually taken my boat entirely apart and crawled into every corner. Albin was doing some very creative marketing.
Both these engines burn same fuel at our hull speed, Beta Marine 38 probably less. The Beta weighs less, its quieter, its smaller, it's more narrow, not as high, and has some great Beta features. As I redo my engine room, I think small would be better.
The Beta is 10" shorter and 6" narrower. Imagine that space. There's Beta 38s in boats configured like ours in Europe for canal and coastal cruising. With the Beta you've re-powering tech help, warranty, and service a phone call away. They do your engine mount mock-up for you. There's not much diff in price between the two. With the Cummings you are very much on you're own.There's just not a lot of other options, and the price is what it is I guess.
Both these engines burn same fuel at our hull speed, Beta Marine 38 probably less. The Beta weighs less, its quieter, its smaller, it's more narrow, not as high, and has some great Beta features. As I redo my engine room, I think small would be better.
The Beta is 10" shorter and 6" narrower. Imagine that space. There's Beta 38s in boats configured like ours in Europe for canal and coastal cruising. With the Beta you've re-powering tech help, warranty, and service a phone call away. They do your engine mount mock-up for you. There's not much diff in price between the two. With the Cummings you are very much on you're own.There's just not a lot of other options, and the price is what it is I guess.